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erinexa's avatar

I'll admit to not having much experience with negative utilitarianism, but at a more meta level, I've become suspicious of motivations defined by what they are AGAINST rather than what they are FOR. I've noticed this in political movements especially: organizations that are to e.g. promote the welfare of immigrants seem far more strategic and effective than those that were just opposed to Trump's immigration laws.

Concepts like loss aversion and social pressure suggest that some people really are motivated by these ideas - Hank below seems to articulate this perspective well. But I have a feeling that outside of a few people whose brains are just well wired for it, most humans will be happier framing their life around what they are excited about, not about what they are afraid of. It's certainly advice I give to friends who seem to be stuck focused on negativity.

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Hank Brunisholz's avatar

I think the counter-intuitive cases you present are troubling for negative hedonistic utilitarianism, but they seem less threatening for a anti-frustrastionist/negative preference utilitarian.

Ord's Examples:

(1) the gym, besides instrumental gains to health/wellbeing from exercise, many also want to be fit/muscly/etc. and working out gets them what they want. Not going to the gym would frustrate those preferences.

(2) nice food, people like nice food, not buying it would frustrate their preference for good cuisine. If someone only wanted to eat rice and beans, it would seem strange to give them caviar and say you improved their wellbeing imo.

(3) sprint for the bus to make it to the theatre, people want to see the beginning of plays. Not sprinting would frustrate that preference

(4) they read great books and listen to beautiful music, people want to experience quality recreation. Sitting in a silent, all-beige room would frustrate those preferences for fun/beauty.

And your examples:

(1) a play my friend would love, but that she otherwise wouldn’t have learned about. Assuming my friend likes to watch great plays, not telling her would frustrate her preferences. If she doesn't already want to see plays, then I don't think its counterintuitive not to tell her instead of suggesting recreation she already wants.

(2) Content with mediocre art until showed a piece of much, much more beautiful art. This might be a counter-example, assuming the former-mediocre-art-enjoyer had no preference for finer art until showed it. But it doesn't feel that counter-intuitive to me to say that a person whose content with their current tastes and would be discontent if you gave them higher tastes wouldn't benefit from getting higher tastes. And if they themselves wanted to become an art snob, not getting to do so would frustrate their preference.

(3) Status-seeker should go on a Napa Valley wine-tasting tour and wine-enjoyer shouldn’t. If the wine-enjoyer wants to go on the wine-tasting tour and the status-seeker doesn't, then the wine-enjoyer should go. if the preferences are reversed/status-seeker prefers to go more than wine-enjoyer, I think I endorse that the status-seeker should go instead.

(4) Children. If you want children, not having them would be preference frustration (although the consideration of the kid's welfare/effects on others might be more important than parental desire.)

(5) Great equanimity. If the guru wants to experience good books and music, not doing so would be preference frustration. And if they don't want that experience, then giving it to them seems neutral to me (e.g. consider a monk who would be as peaceful at a raging party as in quiet contemplation, no preference for either, why go to the trouble of the party?)

Finally, your general support for "your right to pursue your own sense of the Good" seems to align really well with anti-frustrationism, which says that whatever you prefer is good for you to get, but that giving you new preferences and then satisfying them is neutral. That seems right to me and matches up with how I want people to respect my autonomy (giving me a preference for X and then giving me X just isn't something I want to happen to me, otherwise I'd be pursuing X myself already)

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